Vladislav Bevc, A Smiling Slovenia, Interview – 2/2

Q: You claim that Slovenia is not much different place (yet). In the dance of ghosts, has the establishment surrendered? Is being disagreeable what keeps you alive?
Vladislav Bevc: I think nothing ever changes in Slovenia. One can only read Cankar`s writings, for example, from the beginning of the twentieth century and one is reading about Slovenia today.

If Cankar would be still alive, he would without any doubt write about the same subjects, as does Drago Jancar, for example. And unlike Stalin who sent Maxim Gorki "on vacation" – so would Slovenes probably send Cankar to a place where he could be at least - temporarily - silenced.

Note: Ivan Cankar , 1876-1918, Slovene poet. Considered one of the great Slovene literary figures, he was influential in the development of modern satire, symbolic drama, and the psychological novel. The struggle of the outcast poor is a theme of his satirical novel Yerney's Justice (1907, tr. 1926) and many other works. Cankar also wrote satires on politics and culture.

Q: Let`s dwell more in the past. By the time the Berlin wall feel it was apparent that the Yugoslav federation was in a constitutional crises, that the federal government was falling under the hegemony of overtly nationalist politicians. Then Slovene Government - both before and following free election in April 1999 - pursued a well conceived and consistent policy for retaining country`s sovereignty. What is your view?
Vladislav Bevc: At that time I was well on my way of "leaving Yugoslavia behind."

I wasn`t following their "constitutional crisis."

My concern was the repression of liberty - and former Yugoslav regime was repressive. However, Yugoslavia as a state or a federation was a good idea – more - a great idea. I knew one of the founders of Yugoslavia Dr. Vošnjak, personally. I still recall the pledge to the late King Alexander which then Slovene youth was mouthing:

"We shall always guard Yugoslavia, that is our pledge to you, your hope and trust, the Army of Slovene Youth."

Of course, at the first hint the positions of the communists in Slovenia may have shaken the late king’s hope and trust and drove its switchblades into the back of his creation…that is Slovenia for you.

My father worked all his life for free Yugoslavia. Slovenes– always a disruptive element in any political structure – tried and succeeded in preserving the positions of their communist leaders. That was all what they succeeded to do! The cost – the destruction of Yugoslavia. The Yugoslavs are now being blamed for failing to achieve — say in 50 years what other, bigger nations like Italy and Germany, required few centuries to accomplish.

From Yugoslavia, too, I took my farewell.

Q: Can you reflect on these events now and what went "wrong"?
Vladislav Bevc: Taking a long term view - Slovenes, or Slovenia – if you wish – has due to its love for "communism" lost a good third of its national territory. It lost the Julian March and Trieste to Italy and Carinthia to Austria.

One can indeed speak of Slovenia as "rump state".

There never was any sincere support for a nation state among Slovenes.
Following World War I all they wanted is to go home from the Austrian army where they served faithfully until it became too inconvenient and dangerous.

Only handful of them joined General Maister who saved parts of Lower Styria but could not save Carinthia, for example. During World War 2 they opted for Stalin and Communism, antagonizing the Americans who withdrew their initial support for Yugoslavia and supported the Italian and Austrian efforts to hang on to the Slovene territory.

In retrospect the Western powers were absolutely right – it would be tragic should they consigned some 300,000 people to communism on some nebulous theory of national self-determination but which in reality no one really wanted – and much less knew what to do with it.

Q: Why does not the Slovene Diaspora play a more effective role in the filed for investment - for example. What should be done?
Vladislav Bevc: I have included an article in my writing titled: "Warning to Investors" in the book. There is also an article by Mark Ryavec, former Honorary Consul of Slovenia in Los Angeles. Apparently his sincere and quite effective efforts to build solid economic relationships between Slovenia and California were rebuffed and he was put on ice.

As digression I recall how I once tried to induce a large electronic firm to Slovenia, then still part of Yugoslavia, for developing an electric power meter that would accommodate time for use measurement of electric consumption which could be used for energy conservation purposes.

During my first conferences with the top management of that – still government owned – enterprises, I was asked what is required in terms of "gifts" and "personal inducements" to the key executives of that American utilities who would buy their products. I begun to explain that the executives in question were selected and compensated in a manner that any arrangement of the sort they were suggesting – quite common in Europe apparently – would be absolutely out of question. I had a distinct impression that I will not get through.

What do all of the major Slovene enterprises respected monopolies of national importance such as Mercator, Emona, Krka, Gorenje, SCT, Pivovarna Union, Nova Ljubljanska Banka enterprises have in common?

If we overlook that all these businesses operated by communist old boys and their chosen youth, and the fact that they were always receiving government subsidies and taxpayers' money - in one way or another - and that they were "respectable monopolies of national importance," then we see that the first thing they have in common is that the numerous directors of mentioned enterprises - in cooperation with the politicians throughout the time of transition as to this date - sought only for the income for special interest groups while treating the enterprises like pigs trampling on the offal.

Another thing they have in common is that they were created by the most egregious abuse of property rights.

Q: Ethnically inspired self- determination is of course the guiding theme in the political consolidations of the Yugoslav successor states. The pragmatic orientation of Slovene politics for self-determination arguing that the road to independence adopted by Slovene leaders is not merely a reflection of the country`s small population and military impotence but also a consequence of its location on the historical political map of Europe. What role – according to you - should Slovenia play in Europe today?
Vladislav Bevc: I am no expert on Europe and it is hard for me to say what role should Slovenia, San Marino, Austria, Andorra, Luxemburg and all those European countries, play in Europe. I rather think they more or less hold to their own. In the same way, what role do New Mexico, Arizona, Nevada, Oregon, Nebraska, in the United States?

Q: The quest for self- determination in Europe today is contingent upon conformity with internationally established standard for conduction political and commercial affairs. The conditions for international recognition which were recently "imposed" on Europe`s new states and the precondition that third world countries uphold international conventions on human rights as the medium for conduction affairs in the international arena. What do you say?
Vladislav Bevc: I think there was preciously little "imposition" for the observance of human rights – of which I think property rights are the basis – for the new EU members. In my observation no one cares.

The European Court of Human Rights – so called – in Strasburg fails to act in cases involving restitution of property plundered by the communists by its specious "ratione temporis" policy.

The reason is, of course, that the court is packed with East European communist judges who will not allow the achievements of communism to slip away from the communists who benefit from them.

Sure, there is Resolution of the Council of Europe No 1096 on the dismantlement of the heritage of the communist totalitarian systems. But no one enforces this resolutions, least of all the European Court of Human Rights to whom The European Convention on Human Rights and its Protocols is a dead letter.

Q: The 19th century national awakenings were the ideological motor of regionalism in the recent history of Balkan states making – Slovenia included - whereas the wars and interest of great powers within the region (Real Politik) created the chaotic circumstances in which Balkan states were arbitrarily constructed – states with political frontiers that never "satisfy" their respective peoples` modern aspirations for national self- determination. In your writing about the American Policy and Carinthian Slovenes you expose the cynical indifference of American officials towards the Austrian policy of systematic extirpation of Carinthian Slovenes. What is your advice to Carinthian Slovenes?
Vladislav Bevc: I am not in the position to comment and I do not have any advice. Least of all for those who would not listen to it.

Slovenes in Carinthia voted in a plebiscite in 1919 to remain in Austria. Slovenes in Yugoslavia withdrew their troops from Carinthia instead of occupying it – they only worried whether they would be able to feed the population! No one would intervene if Yugoslavia occupied Carinthia but the Slovenes did not push for it.

Acts like this, show political immaturity of a nation and an absolute absence for the support of a nation state. Such acts have consequences, sometimes fatal, as in the case of Carinthia.

On the other hand, perhaps the Austrian bureaucracy is better today than that of Slovenia and Austria is more civilized than today’s Slovenia. Slovenes, as individuals, are more free in Austria.

Q: In your article "From Yalta to Dayton" you argue that it is not true that the USA and Great Britain have no policy for Bosna (or Balkan). You argue that it is still the same policy that has been established for the Balkans by Stalin. What should be done to move forward?
Vladislav Bevc: My argument is that the earlier policy of Britain and Western powers continues.

I believe the argument here is that there are certain interests of Britain, and more recently the United States – although I am not sure of the latter. They seem to have certain interests in the Balkans and those interests are controlling for them. The population in the Balkans is – in my opinion – too interspersed to warrant the national boundaries as they are established today.

The movie "No Man’s land" contains a remark of one of the warring Yugoslav soldiers in the former (Tito’s) Yugoslavia: "there was a place for everyone" (under the communist system and rules of course) and that the new order did away with that. Here is the point, failure to get along with different and differing people has its consequences, which are visible today.

Q: The presence of an expanding European Community, the European Parliament and the CSCE all represent new contingencies for conducting the affairs of state in the community of European countries. Likewise, the economy of all modern states is regulated more these days by transnational commercial institutions and global production systems than by contingencies enforced by parochial state governments, your reflection please?.
Vladislav Bevc: I am not so familiar with Europe and I may not be in position to comment. In the European Parliament , I know slightly Mr. Lojze Paterle but I could not persuade him to take any action in the Parliament – if indeed such action is feasible – regarding the European Court of Human Rights – so called – or property restitution in Slovenia and elsewhere in Eastern Europe.

When Germany was to be unified, it was apparently agreed that the communists would keep their loot. It seems that the other reorganized communist countries expect the same.

One should remember that some of us have come to America to get away from the stifling Europe. From what I see, Europe is getting more and more "socialist" and does not resemble much the Europe - let say - from 50years ago. (Yes I am dating myself.)

It is also getting increasingly less "European".

Q: In course of history, the Slovenes were conscripted into armies and died for causes they did not understand, they were coerced to change their names and resettle in foreign lands and they were told they were Austrians, Italians, Germans. Old rules get old because they have legs to walk through generations. Time, then, to recall one of the oldest. When you are dead, lie down. So many politicians simply do not get this. What is to be done?
Vladislav Bevc: Well Slovenes do not have to serve in any army now. As for serving in the Austrian Army there was at least one Slovene officer, Dr Ljudevit Pivko, who with his entire battalion, consisting of Bosnians and Czechs went over to the Italians and fought on their side as a "Yugoslav Freedom Fighter".

But most Slovenes simply loved their Austrian Emperor, as they later and – even now - loved their Marshal Tito. Until the advent of Tito, of course, you could always get a steamship ticket to America.

That is what I think my father should have done in the thirties - when Hitler stated hollering how he would restructure the world - instead of spending all his time for building Yugoslavia. The buildings and monuments in Ljubljana (the latter destroyed by the Italians), reserve officers organization, Sokol (Falkons) and the like.

Q: Small places with simple economies bred small people with small destinies. Their literary possibilities, like their economic possibilities are as narrow as their human possibilities, writes Naipaul of his native Trinidad. What entrepreneurial initiative would you propose to give the economy a boast today?
Vladislav Bevc: It is a basic fact of life that if you own an enterprise you give it all. If you are just an employee, all you think is your break, lunch and quitting time.

Smallness, in the opinion of many, has nothing to do with the potential for development. The saga of the Sirc family testifies how an entrepreneur can change a region by bringing prosperity through his initiative, risk taking and hard work. I recommend the book "Enterprising Punished" [Original: "Kaznovana podjetnost"] which provides clues to the economic situation in Slovenia.

Ljubo Sirc and all of us have always argued that if the old entrepreneurs or their fillies got their properties back (the "means of production" confiscated under the Marxist system), the free enterprise economy would prosper - and so would Slovenia.

Slovenes opted their economy to be run by the Kucan clan and his "tycoons." They do not see the light and are not likely to see it for the foreseeable future.

Q: Your real passion are buttons of climatic journey. So what`s the" inconvenient truth'? Are we seeing warmth over the Earth, frost over the hearts situation?
Vladislav Bevc: My real passion is finding out in a didactic way (that is in a way poor little me can understand) the transmittal of forces between elementary particles by exchange of virtual photons. I am not trying to redo any theories – just understand them.

As for the "climate change" I am working on a manual that will show EVERYBODY how s/he can make his own calculations as to what the politicians are saying has any merit and if we should destroy our economy because of a correlation between carbon dioxide content in the atmosphere and the temperature.

I think it will take me a year to finish it. (I put Smiling Slovenia together in four months!).

The Earth may be warming but so do Mars, Neptune and Jupiter. Old man Sun and his luminosity has something to do with it. Cycles of warming occur every 600 years.

We should not worry about that. Perhaps a greener Greenland, Siberia and Canadian territories will be a boon for us all. I once raised the question if we could establish a "New Yugoslavia' in Antarctica.

That, of course, went over like a lead balloon.

If your question is more figurative and addresses the frost in the hearts of man, I would naturally welcome some warming. But any such frosting may only be apparent and in reality.

I think once people realize that they – not the leaders – should be the decision makers, all the totalitarian and bureaucratic frost will disappear as Pushkin aptly put it "kak son kak utrenny tujman" [like a dream or morning mist].

Mr. Vladislav Bec, thank you.

REVIEWS:
"Smiling Slovenia" is a voluminous and well-annotated resource with hard-to find commentary, position papers, and documents on issues from Slovene history over the past half-century. The compilation and publication of these items in English will be a spur to necessary discussions and, in addition, might also spark controversy on certain subjects."

John Cox, Professor of History,
North Dakota State University

Bevc, Vladislav (ed) Smiling Slovenia
Political Dissent Papers is published by Peter Lang Publishers
http://www.peterlang.com

PICTURING CULTURAL FESTIVAL IN BLED, SLOVENIA