Saint and Greavsie Say Football on Tv is Now No Laughing Matter
Ian St John and Jimmy Greaves tell Anna Kessel why today's television cannot compare to the way they once covered the game
It has been 17 years since Saint & Greavsie was a Saturday lunchtime ritual for football fans. Now, reunited for a one-off FA Cup special today, the two presenters seem like time travellers, right down to the trademark shirts and comedy double-act exchanges.
"Um, actually this is a new shirt," Jimmy Greaves says. "I can't fit into the old ones, I'm extra large now".
"Tent size," replies Ian St John.
"I had to take the bloody pegs out of the bottom," Greaves returns.
The two fall about laughing and suddenly it's 1990 again, before the Premier League, before Sky Sports, before animated chalkboards and Richard Keys' four-hour broadcast marathons.
They know the game has changed on television, perhaps even more so than on the field.
"A lot of foreign lads have come in so it can't be the same," St John says. "The Britishness of it all has been eroded. It's totally changed in the years we've been away. I think the British humor the public have and we have, that maybe is something we relied on… a lot of the lads do not speak English."
Would their show work in the modern era? "It could – it's whether or not it would be allowed to," Greaves says.
"Over the years we have not been on TV – and you as a Guardian journalist would appreciate this – the world has become far more politically correct and in doing so has lost a massive amount of its humour. It would be more difficult for us to get our messages across, because I'm not sure people would feel comfortable with that humour. The world doesn't laugh anymore, this country doesn't laugh."
Neither are impressed with the football shows on offer today – "No way near as good as ours" says Jimmy – and there is a lingering bitterness at the treatment the two received from Frank Skinner and David Baddiel on Fantasy Football League.
"We were on the show once. They didn't tell us anything pre-show," St John says. "I said: 'I know what they're going to try and do, they're going to try and take the mickey out of us,' and we were not prepared to have that ... it was probably the worst show they ever had."
Not that the former Liverpool striker rated Fantasy Football even when the pair were not the butt of the jokes.
"I didn't like the idea that they were making a living on the back of football, taking the piss out of football. We didn't do that, we laughed with football, which is a different thing."
They still laugh with football via their theatre and after-dinner gigs, both individually and as a duo, but that is as much out of necessity as anything else. The pair discuss their financial situation – "My wife and I are on £200 a week," says St John – and the circumstances of the show's demise.
"To this day nobody at ITV ever lifted the phone or wrote a letter and said, 'By the way ...' you know," St John says. "Isn't that terrible? Never lifted the phone and said: 'Sorry boys it's all over for you,' nothing. And we waited and waited. Jimmy was saying we should turn up next week in the studio."
"If they haven't canceled our contracts we should bill them!" Greaves says. "ITV had a big sulk, they'd lost the football to Sky, everything got wiped off the screen and we got wiped off with it. We knew we were getting the bullet long before, if you see our last ever show, it was him and I on one of these bicycles and we go out singing: 'This will be the last time.'"
Together they lament that television companies are unable to see what older presenters can bring to the screen, and too blinkered to understand their older viewing audience.
"But there's millions of us old bastards out there! We're just not recognised by the media," Greaves says.
"They shut the door on you," St John adds. "There's nothing for old people. The crap that comes on of a Saturday night, it's all for teenagers but they're all out on the piss. Who's watching it? Us! But we don't want to be watching it, we want to watch something that interests us."
The two agree on most things but not tomorrow's FA Cup final. St John, in a show of Merseyside unity, says he hopes "little" Everton triumph while Greaves, who scored more than 100 goals for Chelsea, will be at the game cheering on Guus Hiddink's side with his grandson, if somewhat against his will.
"I will be in Club Wembley with my grandson, who wants to go because he's a Chelsea supporter," he says. "I wasn't going to but it was that or be strangled to death by the missus."
Saint & Greavsie are presenting three mini-programs that will run between 9am and kick-off as part of Setanta 1's coverage of the FA Cup final. Setanta's coverage will be unencrypted for all cable and satellite viewers, not just those that subscribe to Setanta
"Um, actually this is a new shirt," Jimmy Greaves says. "I can't fit into the old ones, I'm extra large now".
"Tent size," replies Ian St John.
"I had to take the bloody pegs out of the bottom," Greaves returns.
The two fall about laughing and suddenly it's 1990 again, before the Premier League, before Sky Sports, before animated chalkboards and Richard Keys' four-hour broadcast marathons.
They know the game has changed on television, perhaps even more so than on the field.
"A lot of foreign lads have come in so it can't be the same," St John says. "The Britishness of it all has been eroded. It's totally changed in the years we've been away. I think the British humor the public have and we have, that maybe is something we relied on… a lot of the lads do not speak English."
Would their show work in the modern era? "It could – it's whether or not it would be allowed to," Greaves says.
"Over the years we have not been on TV – and you as a Guardian journalist would appreciate this – the world has become far more politically correct and in doing so has lost a massive amount of its humour. It would be more difficult for us to get our messages across, because I'm not sure people would feel comfortable with that humour. The world doesn't laugh anymore, this country doesn't laugh."
Neither are impressed with the football shows on offer today – "No way near as good as ours" says Jimmy – and there is a lingering bitterness at the treatment the two received from Frank Skinner and David Baddiel on Fantasy Football League.
"We were on the show once. They didn't tell us anything pre-show," St John says. "I said: 'I know what they're going to try and do, they're going to try and take the mickey out of us,' and we were not prepared to have that ... it was probably the worst show they ever had."
Not that the former Liverpool striker rated Fantasy Football even when the pair were not the butt of the jokes.
"I didn't like the idea that they were making a living on the back of football, taking the piss out of football. We didn't do that, we laughed with football, which is a different thing."
They still laugh with football via their theatre and after-dinner gigs, both individually and as a duo, but that is as much out of necessity as anything else. The pair discuss their financial situation – "My wife and I are on £200 a week," says St John – and the circumstances of the show's demise.
"To this day nobody at ITV ever lifted the phone or wrote a letter and said, 'By the way ...' you know," St John says. "Isn't that terrible? Never lifted the phone and said: 'Sorry boys it's all over for you,' nothing. And we waited and waited. Jimmy was saying we should turn up next week in the studio."
"If they haven't canceled our contracts we should bill them!" Greaves says. "ITV had a big sulk, they'd lost the football to Sky, everything got wiped off the screen and we got wiped off with it. We knew we were getting the bullet long before, if you see our last ever show, it was him and I on one of these bicycles and we go out singing: 'This will be the last time.'"
Together they lament that television companies are unable to see what older presenters can bring to the screen, and too blinkered to understand their older viewing audience.
"But there's millions of us old bastards out there! We're just not recognised by the media," Greaves says.
"They shut the door on you," St John adds. "There's nothing for old people. The crap that comes on of a Saturday night, it's all for teenagers but they're all out on the piss. Who's watching it? Us! But we don't want to be watching it, we want to watch something that interests us."
The two agree on most things but not tomorrow's FA Cup final. St John, in a show of Merseyside unity, says he hopes "little" Everton triumph while Greaves, who scored more than 100 goals for Chelsea, will be at the game cheering on Guus Hiddink's side with his grandson, if somewhat against his will.
"I will be in Club Wembley with my grandson, who wants to go because he's a Chelsea supporter," he says. "I wasn't going to but it was that or be strangled to death by the missus."
Saint & Greavsie are presenting three mini-programs that will run between 9am and kick-off as part of Setanta 1's coverage of the FA Cup final. Setanta's coverage will be unencrypted for all cable and satellite viewers, not just those that subscribe to Setanta
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